As you rightly point out, the belief in creation ex nihilo not only “guarantees” but necessarily requires creation to be understood as symbolic - that is, as you said, “different in kind/nature” from God. These are dualistic beliefs rooted in ontological separation between God and creation.
Alternatively, I argue and humbly ask you to consider the possibility that creation is not created ex nihilo or symbolic, but is in fact ex Dues and truly sacramental. Creation isn’t an ontologically disjointed sign that points to the Truth, but is the very manifestation of Truth itself - God incarnate as creation. Creation is not different in kind/nature from God. Sacramental creation is the very revelation and presence of God as creation.
This is exactly what Jesus Christ revealed and is the very purpose of the Incarnation. The Incarnation did not ontologically unite or re-unite the symbolic with the real and true. The Incarnation reveals the sacramental nature of creation. As the man Jesus, Christ didn’t become something other than God, become a symbol of God, or unite ontologically separated divine and human natures.
Likewise, through deification, man does not become united to the God who is separate from him, but rather actualizes the inherent and essential divine potential which he (and all of sacramental creation) truly is. Likewise, the bread and wine of the Eucharist, as sacrament, do not become something that they aren’t, but are revealed as that which they always already are - God’s presence and inherent communion with, in, and as creation.
This is actually very interesting! However, my question would be what if creation contradictory due to the fall and modernity at its last legs? Meaning that God cannot be creation directly, nor can creation be totally distinct from God. What would you say?
I’m not exactly sure what you’re asking, but what I’m pointing to is a view of Reality that is non-dual, pantheistic, and Trinitarian. The transcendent Father manifests by the power of the Holy Spirit as the immanent, Christic cosmos. There is no ontological separation between God, man, and the cosmos. Nothing is apart from God and nothing is a part of God - yet all is God made manifest. The entire cosmos is sacramental not symbolic.
As a wave is nothing other than the water which the one ocean is, so creation is nothing other than the multitudinous manifestation of the One God which it is. Just as infinitely many waves are distinct but not separate from the one ocean that they are, so creation is distinct but not separate from the one God that it is.
Wonderful work here! When I first read AllHeart's article on Christian phenomenology I realized that the modern obsession with a "literal" description of reality and the degradation of the value of symbolism to a function of mere adornment coalesces perfectly with the self-relational logic of the modern conceptions of knowledge, freedom and relationships. A "pure literal meaning" is a vacuous notion, it is A = A, tautalogical indeterminacy, absolute self-relation. There isn't a "literal" dimension of reality and a "symbolic" dimension superimposed onto it, all of reality is always-already symbolic, being is communion means being is symbolism.
Hello, friendly question/critique: I like the idea of the communal ontology, however, when you say the real is out of symbolic it brings to mind the Lacanian notion of the real as the redoubled gap inherent to the symbolic order. What would your response to Lacan be, in that the symbolic can never fully encompass the real in language, speech, or symbol.
I see your point that all creation or the real itself is already a symbol of God, but I think collapsing the symbolic into the real can cause problems. What do you think tho?
As you rightly point out, the belief in creation ex nihilo not only “guarantees” but necessarily requires creation to be understood as symbolic - that is, as you said, “different in kind/nature” from God. These are dualistic beliefs rooted in ontological separation between God and creation.
Alternatively, I argue and humbly ask you to consider the possibility that creation is not created ex nihilo or symbolic, but is in fact ex Dues and truly sacramental. Creation isn’t an ontologically disjointed sign that points to the Truth, but is the very manifestation of Truth itself - God incarnate as creation. Creation is not different in kind/nature from God. Sacramental creation is the very revelation and presence of God as creation.
This is exactly what Jesus Christ revealed and is the very purpose of the Incarnation. The Incarnation did not ontologically unite or re-unite the symbolic with the real and true. The Incarnation reveals the sacramental nature of creation. As the man Jesus, Christ didn’t become something other than God, become a symbol of God, or unite ontologically separated divine and human natures.
Likewise, through deification, man does not become united to the God who is separate from him, but rather actualizes the inherent and essential divine potential which he (and all of sacramental creation) truly is. Likewise, the bread and wine of the Eucharist, as sacrament, do not become something that they aren’t, but are revealed as that which they always already are - God’s presence and inherent communion with, in, and as creation.
This is actually very interesting! However, my question would be what if creation contradictory due to the fall and modernity at its last legs? Meaning that God cannot be creation directly, nor can creation be totally distinct from God. What would you say?
I’m not exactly sure what you’re asking, but what I’m pointing to is a view of Reality that is non-dual, pantheistic, and Trinitarian. The transcendent Father manifests by the power of the Holy Spirit as the immanent, Christic cosmos. There is no ontological separation between God, man, and the cosmos. Nothing is apart from God and nothing is a part of God - yet all is God made manifest. The entire cosmos is sacramental not symbolic.
As a wave is nothing other than the water which the one ocean is, so creation is nothing other than the multitudinous manifestation of the One God which it is. Just as infinitely many waves are distinct but not separate from the one ocean that they are, so creation is distinct but not separate from the one God that it is.
Wonderful work here! When I first read AllHeart's article on Christian phenomenology I realized that the modern obsession with a "literal" description of reality and the degradation of the value of symbolism to a function of mere adornment coalesces perfectly with the self-relational logic of the modern conceptions of knowledge, freedom and relationships. A "pure literal meaning" is a vacuous notion, it is A = A, tautalogical indeterminacy, absolute self-relation. There isn't a "literal" dimension of reality and a "symbolic" dimension superimposed onto it, all of reality is always-already symbolic, being is communion means being is symbolism.
Hello, friendly question/critique: I like the idea of the communal ontology, however, when you say the real is out of symbolic it brings to mind the Lacanian notion of the real as the redoubled gap inherent to the symbolic order. What would your response to Lacan be, in that the symbolic can never fully encompass the real in language, speech, or symbol.
I see your point that all creation or the real itself is already a symbol of God, but I think collapsing the symbolic into the real can cause problems. What do you think tho?